Bait Clips

[simonvicos]

I use quite a lot of fixed paternoster rigs wih single hookbaits. When I cast they do flap about a bit and limit the distance I can get, also some of the bait can fly off when I do this.

I know I need to clip it down and it will be easier to cast but just how do these things work. I have a few of the black plastic ones. Can I be sure they will release the bait on touchdown ?. Do I allow it to slide or fix it ?

Help

[sallysludgebucket]

Are they the Breakaway Impact shields matey ?
http://www.peche2caps.net/materiel/images/impact%20shield.jpg Instead of crimping in place, a couple of silicone tube short lengths formed into a figure of eight on the main line ( pass the mono line through a 5mm length, then pass through again moisten and slide into position ) will hold and be easily adjustable if the snood stretches, dont forget the bead between the stops and the shield though to ensure release.

Can easily use breakaway leads which have a bait clip release system built in as well.
A dirt cheap way is to chop a paperclip up to form a shallow hook shape and slide inside a length of silicone tube on the main rig body.

[Pelamid]

Breakaway also make IMPS - easy to put on and release every time.

[Bootster]

I always use the Breakaway jobbies that Sally mentioned, however if using 'normal' clips, rather than buy them snip a paperclip in a J shape, thread some silicon tubing on the line and then the J and bend the end over to prevent it sipping out. Costs about....ooooo 1p per clip rather than than 10p plus of the purpose made jobbies. Just get either plastic coated or rust proof clips.

Idea behind them is that the line streches slightly on the cast loosening the line slightly, this then means the hook releases on impact. Release depends on how you build the rig, don't make the hooklink too tight, I find the swivel at the paternoster under slight tension, but the leader still straight is best (does that make sense?). If set up correctly you should have almost 100% release but the very odd one will refuse to release, mainly with short casts.

[simonvicos]

Thanks Guys. The ones I have are the black plastic ones. I printed off the diagram to help me set it up correctly.

If the bait clip was left free running then surely on the cast it would retain it's aero dynamic-ness and on impact would slide up the line thus releasing the hook

Sound sensible ?, any flaws in the plan ?

[gs425e]

hi i dont think it matters what short of bait clips you use as i have found the all to let you down at some point and i have tried a lot, the impact shield need big hooks to guarentee a release gemini clips can catch the trace line and tangle the breakaweay leads dont always realease but drop off on the retreve so thinking they have realeased so now i always use short snood flapper rigs do the job and cast as far as you need with modern tackle the distance casting thing only matter if your using old mismatched tackle get new modern gear that is matched and you will be able to cast as far as you need to andy

[OneCodBob]

Looks like you lot need an introduction to the device, you wont be messing about with bait clips with one of these. The device is designed to carry your baited hooks during casting and it ejects them when it hits the water. you can fish with previuosly uncastable soft baits and present head hooked ragworm for instance at great distance, safe in the knowledge that the bait reached its target intact.
Take a look.http://www.fishyrob.co.uk/DVice/index.htm

OCB.

[bluejt2000]

If the bait clip was left free running then surely on the cast it would retain it's aero dynamic-ness and on impact would slide up the line thus releasing the hook


The Breakaway clips, shown in the diagram posted near the beginning of the thread, if that is the one you mean, do slide up the trace on impact. What happens when it strikes the water is that the pressure forces the clip to slide up and strike the bead above it. As it tries to rise further up the trace the bead forces the angled clip to one side and the trace body slides down the groove in it, pushing the hook off.

The clip needs to be held tightly to the trace body by the tubing so that tension, which is necessary to hold the hook in place during the cast, can be applied. Furthermore, air pressure when the lead is on its journey would cause the clip to release.

That would be okay, but part of the clip's job is to hold the baited hook behind the lead, where it is protected from slipstream damage by the relatively calm pocket of air behind it. Moreover, the clip is designed to shield the bait on impact with the water - hence it's name, the impact clip. Neither of these would occur if the clip released early in the cast.

I hope this helps.

Cheers,

John

[bluejt2000]

Looks like you lot need an introduction to the device, you wont be messing about with bait clips with one of these. The device is designed to carry your baited hooks during casting and it ejects them when it hits the water. you can fish with previuosly uncastable soft baits and present head hooked ragworm for instance at great distance, safe in the knowledge that the bait reached its target intact.
Take a look.http://www.fishyrob.co.uk/DVice/index.htm

OCB.

Thank you for a very interesting link! On returning to the hobby not so long I ago I was wondering what had happened to the bait safe. I'm interested in trying one of these but couldn't find any indication of the actual weight of the device. Are they available in a range of weights?

Cheers,

John

[wilba]

Breakaway also make IMPS - easy to put on and release every time.


i started using these and they are great cant see how they can fail to release:)
well worth trying

[OneCodBob]

Thank you for a very interesting link! On returning to the hobby not so long I ago I was wondering what had happened to the bait safe. I'm interested in trying one of these but couldn't find any indication of the actual weight of the device. Are they available in a range of weights?

Cheers,

John

Hello John,
The device in its current guise weighs in at around 160 grams, because of its weight forward balance and the long length of the body it does hold rather well in strong tide conditions and is therefore sufficient for most aplications, this does not mean that it wont be available in various weights in the future, but for the meantime we have found this variant most commonly useful.
http://www.fishyrob.co.uk/DVice/index.htm
Cheers,

OCB.

[John Mason]

My Dvices arrived this morning. Looking forward to trying them out!

Fishing baits at range but on 6ft+++ traces is the plan.

Having a job to get hold of Gemini breakout heads though. Emailed them and was told they're only available as part of the kit to make up complete weights. So I'm gonna hope they hold OK on their own. They look as though they ought to, unless it's a very big tide and there's weed about. Ideal for many of the local beaches which are snag-free.

Cheers - John

[bluejt2000]

Having a job to get hold of Gemini breakout heads though. Emailed them and was told they're only available as part of the kit to make up complete weights. So I'm gonna hope they hold OK on their own. They look as though they ought to, unless it's a very big tide and there's weed about. Ideal for many of the local beaches which are snag-free.

Cheers - John

John,

Your post has given me some ideas for alternative nose sections based on stuff called Milliput. It's a two-part expoy putty that can be kneaded and moulded into any shape, sets rock hard, and can be obtained from craft and model shops. A lump of this could be pushed onto the end of the DVice and soft, springy wires pushed into the end. Or, one could try inserting wires of a larger diameter than the grip wires and, before the stuff has fully hardened, remove them. It then ought to be possible to insert the grip wires, bend them to shape, and hold them in place with elastic bands like homemade breakaways. If the thread on the DVice is greased before the Milliput is pressed on then it might just be possible to make removeable nose cones so that different types of grips can be used.

I've ordered some DVices and I'll give it a try myself when they arrive.

Cheers,

John

[fishyrob]

My Dvices arrived this morning. Looking forward to trying them out!

Fishing baits at range but on 6ft+++ traces is the plan.

Having a job to get hold of Gemini breakout heads though. Emailed them and was told they're only available as part of the kit to make up complete weights. So I'm gonna hope they hold OK on their own. They look as though they ought to, unless it's a very big tide and there's weed about. Ideal for many of the local beaches which are snag-free.

Cheers - John

Hi John,
Sorry to hear you are struggling to get hold of heads. The stratergy of not developing our own head was to keep prices down, and if this meant Gemini sold a few more bits, then we would be very pleased, as the guys gave us some very kind and practical advice regarding our own project. Plus their bits are top quality!!
We also, and obviously wrongly, guessed that everybody has a few spare Gemini heads knocking around in the dark corners of their tackle box!!
We will contact Gemini directly, and see if their is a solution. Should there not be a solution then we will carry on with our own, as we did get quite a way down the road there. We did also work out that with our UK based production, the DVice would probably cost £1 more per item. This is what we wanted to avoid, as it is important to us to get them out on the beach where they belong, and didnt want to price them out of anglers wallets.
Cheers
Robin

[John Mason]

Good stuff Robin,

I was surprised by Gemini to be honest as they sell the fixed-grip heads "loose", as it were. However those are OTT for around here and I've always used breakaways. You'd think there would be a market for spare breakout-heads, wouldn't you?

I'm hoping to get out fishing tomorrow as these stiff easterlies are forecast to go to variable 3-4. Quite sizeable tides still so I'll try it without any wires and see how it holds!


Cheers - John

[gs425e]

hi is a bigger version avaliable for uptiding? andy

[OneCodBob]

hi is a bigger version avaliable for uptiding? andy

Hello Andy,

What exactly do you mean by bigger? weight or capacity?

The device is large enough to take a whole de boned squid, and weighs in at 160 grams. It has all of its mass well forward which coupled with the long body gives the device a good ground holding lever and fished using standard uptiding methods hold very well. I have also found that it makes casting from a boat much safer, as the hooks a neatly tucked away and the hook link can also be tucked inside, no more trying to cast your mates rod over board.

Cheers,

OCB.

[fishyrob]

hi is a bigger version avaliable for uptiding? andy

Hi Andy. You can come and have a look for yourself tomorrow night if you want. I will be on the beach at Hove East of the King Alfred. Look for a white Mondeo Estate on the road, and I will be on the beach below. This is a little reccy ready for our bass trip we were discussing a couple of months ago. Hope to get down there for about 7 pm.

[lobbit]

gemini geni clips are good they double up as a link - no sliding about and they are metal the plastic slidy ones are good also but can move about of theyre own accord i usually fix em with a knot and bead

[big guy]

i use the breakaway impact shield for the bottom hook and cascade swivels for the other snoods. fail safe and so neat.

i also use the pompey rig a lot for when i want to put 2 hooks the same distance as a single one (usually match fishing).

[Pennel]

The new Splashdown Lead works well 4me,holds secure,releases every time,makes OTG casting much easier as the hook wont slip out the clip wen on the ground.

[Swaders]

Hi I was looking through the " Sea Angler " and noticed the way you can put them clipped up or down

what is the best way if any

regards Brian

[chicken_eyebrows]

I'd use clipped up if I wanted to present the bait nearer the bottom, as generally if you're using a clipped up rig, the trace connects to the rig body just above the lead so when it releases the bait hangs lower than the lead (i.e. rests on the bottom).

Also whether its clipped up or down can affect the way the bait moves during the cast, with clipped up rigs the bait tends to move down towards the bend of the hook in flight, with clipped down it tries to move over the eye of the hook and up the trace line, so a bait stop is a good idea with these.

[Little-Red]

Good points there, rig design is key to the efficiency of bait clips.

Regarding paper clips, this was our starting point for bait clips back in the 60's. The main problem was they straighten on a powerful cast. IMO imps are about as good a design as is available currently.