Tying Feathers

[paulie]

I want to tie my own mackeral feathers. I know they are cheap to buy but I would like to know how to tie my own in case tackle shops are closed and to give me something to do in the summer when I can't fish.

So what knot is normally used on the feather rigs that you can buy in the shops i.e. where line is tied to line without any swivels or crimps.

Plus what strengths of line?

Cheers

Paulie

[Tyn]

The Sea Angler Rig and Bait book shows you how to make up feathers. For the £10ish that it costs, it's a good buy for a newbie.

[lobbit]

pass line through the hooks eye 60lb or 80lb (stiffer the better imho mackeral aint fussed and are in fact atracted by line flash )make a loop along the hook including the feather shank
wind the line around the hook and through the loop created pull tight
no need for anything else

tie up a 4 flapper rig and wrap tin foil round the hooks for a quick n simple macky rig thats a killer

you can add more detail if you want by tying it on with thread n super glue but mackys are voracious predators and and go for anything flashing like an injured fish

cost pennys btw get feathers from stationers for 50p a bag

[sharpshooter]

As mentioned it is pretty easy. Mackerel aint really that fussy, and as they tend to move in shoals they must compete for food, so if they think about it too long they will miss out to the next fish.

I tie sets of mackerel gear proffessionally, though they are not really for anglers!! Usually about 9m long with 30 or more hooks on :) I flog em to commercial handline fishermen. Set up my own little vat registered company :)

Too long winded to explain how i do it exactly, but if you PM me your address i will send ya some Mustad commercial mackerel hooks, and enough materials to get you started. I can draw diagrams of how i tie em, much quicker than trying to explain it in words.

As said. Got thousands (and thousands lol) of hooks and $hite loads of materials, so the offer is there if you want it.
Obviously free of charge :)

SS

[EoinMag]

I'd be interested in diagrams and instructions on what materials etc, if you were happy to pass that information on, it'd be pleasing to catch macks with my own tied rigs :D
Thanks in advance.

[Rajabatis]

I'd be interested in diagrams and instructions on what materials etc, if you were happy to pass that information on, it'd be pleasing to catch macks with my own tied rigs :D
Thanks in advance.
Hi Eoin Just hold any feather of your choice parallel (fluffy Marabou is brill)with the hook shank and lash it on with thread or mono. Some superglue to seal the thread or varnish and away you go!

Any progress with the line test?

[EoinMag]

Hi Eoin Just hold any feather of your choice parallel (fluffy Marabou is brill)with the hook shank and lash it on with thread or mono. Some superglue to seal the thread or varnish and away you go!

Any progress with the line test?

Not yet, I'll get to it, thanks for the advice.
It's just a time thing really, went for a session this weekend and had no time to get the test organised beforehand. Might get out this weekend though.

[girlfish]

I'd be interested in diagrams and instructions on what materials etc, if you were happy to pass that information on, it'd be pleasing to catch macks with my own tied rigs :D
Thanks in advance.

me too :) ditto...

[girlfish]

RE:

Hi Eoin Just hold any feather of your choice parallel (fluffy Marabou is brill)with the hook shank and lash it on with thread or mono. Some superglue to seal the thread or varnish and away you go!


Would knicker elastic work???:g:

:oops:


:roll1:

[lobbit]

http://www.geocities.com/tony2kuk/rigs.html
shazzam

just attach your feathered hook instead of bare hook described and forget swivel use your mainline one tie loops at each end instead

[Rajabatis]

RE:

Hi Eoin Just hold any feather of your choice parallel (fluffy Marabou is brill)with the hook shank and lash it on with thread or mono. Some superglue to seal the thread or varnish and away you go!


Would knicker elastic work???:g:

:oops:


:roll1:
Yes but your knickers will fall down!:clap3:

[paulie]

Thanks for the info guys

Paulie

[sallysludgebucket]

I spent all last winter tieing anything that looked pretty on a hook to test through the summer, the winner by a very long shot was --------?

Xmas tinsel held in place on the hook shank with the knotless knot, no glue no mess and all but indestructable when tied with thick old mono. The tinsel I prefered was iridecent and thick which I unraveled so I had what looked like long combs of silver strands with a seam. When whipped in place it holds above the eye via the seam and the long strands look pretty dam close to a sand eel or spratt in the water. Had launce, macky, pollock even the odd schooly !

Knotless Knot (http://freespace.virgin.net/keith.whitehouse/Fishing%20Knots/knotless.htm)

Found I could tie slightly longer snoods by making my own which were more suited to float fishing.

[m.b3]

I spent all last winter tieing anything that looked pretty on a hook to test through the summer, the winner by a very long shot was --------?

Xmas tinsel held in place on the hook shank with the knotless knot, no glue no mess and all but indestructable when tied with thick old mono. The tinsel I prefered was iridecent and thick which I unraveled so I had what looked like long combs of silver strands with a seam. When whipped in place it holds above the eye via the seam and the long strands look pretty dam close to a sand eel or spratt in the water. Had launce, macky, pollock even the odd schooly !

Knotless Knot (http://freespace.virgin.net/keith.whitehouse/Fishing%20Knots/knotless.htm)

Found I could tie slightly longer snoods by making my own which were more suited to float fishing.

agreed! xmas tinsel is the biz! a small luminous bead and a silver sequin above and they are lethal.

[dean_gifford]

As a software engineer student ive always been taught to try and modulise everything and make everything i build reuseable in different situations, with this in mind i started thining about making a feather rig( ive made variable pullys, flappers etc by just having variable snoods, no bigy there.)

i do alot of course fishing so i encounter load of little tips from the course anglers, just got a wicked new way to make stand offs by introducing a twist to the line, i think this will work really well for feathers as it will hold the hook well off the trace to elimate tangles plus you'll be able to change hooks (/lures) really easily in response to the type of fish your fishing for etc. i will get some high-vis string and tye a example rig up and post the pictures up.

[lobbit]

As a software engineer student ive always been taught to try and modulise everything and make everything i build reuseable in different situations, with this in mind i started thining about making a feather rig( ive made variable pullys, flappers etc by just having variable snoods, no bigy there.)

i do alot of course fishing so i encounter load of little tips from the course anglers, just got a wicked new way to make stand offs by introducing a twist to the line, i think this will work really well for feathers as it will hold the hook well off the trace to elimate tangles plus you'll be able to change hooks (/lures) really easily in response to the type of fish your fishing for etc. i will get some high-vis string and tye a example rig up and post the pictures up.

or just rip up a fag pkt and wrap the foil round yer hook

[Rajabatis]

or just rip up a fag pkt and wrap the foil round yer hook
Dean_Gifford quote:wicked new way to make stand offs by introducing a twist to the line, i think this will work really well for feathers as it will hold the hook well off the trace to elimate tangles plus you'll be able to change hooks (/lures) really easily in response to the type of fish your fishing for etc


Lobbit I don't think thats what Dean was saying?

[paulie]

I spent all last winter tieing anything that looked pretty on a hook to test through the summer, the winner by a very long shot was --------?

Xmas tinsel held in place on the hook shank with the knotless knot, no glue no mess and all but indestructable when tied with thick old mono. The tinsel I prefered was iridecent and thick which I unraveled so I had what looked like long combs of silver strands with a seam. When whipped in place it holds above the eye via the seam and the long strands look pretty dam close to a sand eel or spratt in the water. Had launce, macky, pollock even the odd schooly !

Knotless Knot (http://freespace.virgin.net/keith.whitehouse/Fishing%20Knots/knotless.htm)

Found I could tie slightly longer snoods by making my own which were more suited to float fishing.

But then how do you tie your snood to the main rig line? Or are you just float fishing with one hook?

OR do you keep tying hooks along the line so there is no separation between the hook and the main rig? i.e. no snood length???

Paulie

[lobbit]

Dean_Gifford quote:wicked new way to make stand offs by introducing a twist to the line, i think this will work really well for feathers as it will hold the hook well off the trace to elimate tangles plus you'll be able to change hooks (/lures) really easily in response to the type of fish your fishing for etc


Lobbit I don't think thats what Dean was saying?
lol
60/80lb mono of 3/4 inches wont tangle ,its like like a badgers whisker

[sallysludgebucket]

But then how do you tie your snood to the main rig line? Or are you just float fishing with one hook?

OR do you keep tying hooks along the line so there is no separation between the hook and the main rig? i.e. no snood length???

Paulie

I hold the made up feather snood alongside the mainline, hold together, forma look, pass both through 3 times, moisten and pull tight, trim the tag end of the snood. I check that the position of the next snood up the main will not touch and tie another, I can add upto 10 hooks on rigs made for my 18ft rod ! LOL

Several knots work, each to their own really. Their is a 'right' and a wrong way to connect a set of feather s to your line, when you hold them up does the feather stand off the mainline, or lie by its side. If you are fishing off a boat in theory its better to have them alongside the mainline as fish are caught on the drop. From the shore, floating I have found it far better to have them standing off like mini booms.

Sharpshooter is the man to ask about knots for the purpose, I hear he ties a 'few' LOL

TO be honest 3 is plenty, the thick iresecent Xmas tinsel is very effective, picks out the larger fish, 3 x 2lb macky is more than enough to lift up a wall, pier, rocks etc !

I tie spare snoods and carry them wrapped on a length of foam pipe lagging and in turn slide that on the leg of my tripod ( thank you Mr Houlton, great tip ! ) I can then change hook size, pattern and snood length easily or fish a single snood.

When you are packing up their is nothing worse than trying to pack away a used set of feathers, simply wrap on pipe lagging and stick the hooks in. Easy to swill off in fresh water, dry and undo the next session.

[David Gould]

Sally ,

Can you put a picture of a couple of the steps you mention in the above thread ... I'm so thick ....I need pictures .... as they paint a thousand words, especially for the bit about connecting the feathered hook lengths to the rig body length.( I guess you went a bit loopy on that one :kissing: )

Regards
David

[Rajabatis]

lol
60/80lb mono of 3/4 inches wont tangle ,its like like a badgers whisker

Dean_Gifford quote:wicked new way to make stand offs by introducing a twist to the line, i think this will work really well for feathers as it will hold the hook well off the trace to elimate tangles plus you'll be able to change hooks (/lures) really easily in response to the type of fish your fishing for etc

Lets not put the guy of posting by laughing at his idea before it is even posted!

[bluejt2000]

I want to tie my own mackeral feathers. I know they are cheap to buy but I would like to know how to tie my own in case tackle shops are closed and to give me something to do in the summer when I can't fish.

So what knot is normally used on the feather rigs that you can buy in the shops i.e. where line is tied to line without any swivels or crimps.

Plus what strengths of line?

Cheers

Paulie

Unless the hooks you are using are the spade end type (with a flattened end instead of an eye) you need only use the knot you use to tie on hooks to your standard traces. The knot used to form the droppers, or hook lengths that stand off from the rig body, on most commercial rigs is called a water knot. Commercial feathered rigs usually just have loops at either end for attaching weights or mainline, but it's better to use your standard swivels/links for this purpose.

To fully explain how to do all this would be dificult and the result too long-winded. If you PM me I'll send you a scan of an article that appeared in an old Sea Angler mag showing with step-by-step photos how to tie a simple feathered trace from scratch.

Cheers,

John

[lobbit]

Dean_Gifford quote:wicked new way to make stand offs by introducing a twist to the line, i think this will work really well for feathers as it will hold the hook well off the trace to elimate tangles plus you'll be able to change hooks (/lures) really easily in response to the type of fish your fishing for etc

Lets not put the guy of posting by laughing at his idea before it is even posted!

of course your right and i appoligise to dean but i was trying to point out that in the case of mackie traces theres no need for fancy stuff imho the simpliest of rigs work just as well as the complicated ones
want a laugh check my efforts out v
(hooks so blunt i had trouble getting them to stay on the door lol)
http://img238.imageshack.us/img238/9874/dsc00092xx8.th.jpg (http://img238.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dsc00092xx8.jpg)

the pink terrors lol
im actually intrigued by the rig he described it sounds like a real alternative for a flapper set up which of course is basically a feather set up
look forward to seeing it

[Rajabatis]

Originally Posted by Rajabatis
Dean_Gifford quote:wicked new way to make stand offs by introducing a twist to the line, i think this will work really well for feathers as it will hold the hook well off the trace to elimate tangles plus you'll be able to change hooks (/lures) really easily in response to the type of fish your fishing for etc

Lets not put the guy of posting by laughing at his idea before it is even posted!





of course your right and i appoligise to dean but i was trying to point out that in the case of mackie traces theres no need for fancy stuff imho the simpliest of rigs work just as well as the complicated ones
want a laugh check my efforts out v
(hooks so blunt i had trouble getting them to stay on the door lol)
http://img238.imageshack.us/img238/9874/dsc00092xx8.th.jpg (http://img238.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dsc00092xx8.jpg)

the pink terrors lol
im actually intrigued by the rig he described it sounds like a real alternative for a flapper set up which of course is basically a feather set up
look forward to seeing it

Glad to hear that Lobbit but if you had read the post before jumping in you would have seen he wasn't giving any fancy stuff for the feathers was he?. The rig thing might have been interesting.

I dropped Dean a Pm after your post asking him to post the info but got no reply unfortunately.

Maybe you could try PMing him yourself?

[Salar]

I find mini feathers work well when mackeral are hard to find. They rip up shop-bought mini-shrimp lures so I tie my own with 20lb line to size 6 or 8 hooks, all the instructions are on my web site here http://www.boat-angling.co.uk/5.html
I agree, Christmas gift wrap is a great source of materials.

PS to store them here is another tip
http://www.boat-angling.co.uk/4.html

[dean_gifford]

Sorry about the late reply, I’ve been trying to sort out my server to post some pictures on but there’s some errors coming up that my mate was suppose to fix tonight but he got side tracked. Basically the trace is made of a single piece of line, a twist is introduce to the line its self but only in the area where you want the snood to be. by pulling the center of the area where you've introduced the twist then letting the line fold back on its self a stand off will be made which will look like 2 pieces of line twisted together with a loop at the end, all you have to do to keep the snood like this is to tie a 4 turn water knot at the base of the snood and the twist will be permanent.

You just repeat this process for how ever many snoods you like.
The reason i like this idea is because:
Its really cheap to do.
There are no knots that leave any loose ends.
You can change the lure/feather type according to the species your targeting.
Snood is less prone to damage from the teeth of fish due to there being 2 strands of line rather than one. (also ive been playing with a trace with 4 strands of line braided for maybe rough ground ray or huss fishing, cheap rig so not too much of a loss if you loose a few, and stronger snoods by braiding your line?)

If you give me a day or two to kick my mates a** into sorting out my server ill post the pics.

[lobbit]

Sorry about the late reply, I’ve been trying to sort out my server to post some pictures on but there’s some errors coming up that my mate was suppose to fix tonight but he got side tracked. Basically the trace is made of a single piece of line, a twist is introduce to the line its self but only in the area where you want the snood to be. by pulling the center of the area where you've introduced the twist then letting the line fold back on its self a stand off will be made which will look like 2 pieces of line twisted together with a loop at the end, all you have to do to keep the snood like this is to tie a 4 turn water knot at the base of the snood and the twist will be permanent.

You just repeat this process for how ever many snoods you like.
The reason i like this idea is because:
Its really cheap to do.
There are no knots that leave any loose ends.
You can change the lure/feather type according to the species your targeting.
Snood is less prone to damage from the teeth of fish due to there being 2 strands of line rather than one. (also ive been playing with a trace with 4 strands of line braided for maybe rough ground ray or huss fishing, cheap rig so not too much of a loss if you loose a few, and stronger snoods by braiding your line?)

If you give me a day or two to kick my mates a** into sorting out my server ill post the pics.

look forward to seeing those pics dean i think thats a very adaptable rig btw
try using a host for pics and post url link photoshacks a fairly decent one

[David Gould]

It has been bothering me that none of us has really come up with a quick easy way to tie the feathers to a rig. that didn't involve making a series of thumb knots or loops in the rig body before you attached the hook lengths .

I have successfully managed to unpick a factory made rig and hand drawn the knots used on it ( Very similar to sharpshooters tie up.)

Hopefully I have faithfully recorded it , you can now make rigs as long as you like fairly quickly and if you cobble a jig together a bit like the drawing with perhaps a double set of pins on the right you will also be able to quickly and consistently tie them to set spacings for the hook lengths .

Click on a picture to enlarge it.

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/th_20070425Featherknots004.jpg (http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070425Featherknots004.jpg)
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/th_20070425Featherknots003.jpg (http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070425Featherknots003.jpg)
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/th_20070425Featherknots002.jpg (http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070425Featherknots002.jpg)
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/th_20070425Featherknots001.jpg (http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070425Featherknots001.jpg)

Top and bottom loops are figure of eight knots .... if you fish a rig from a boat and jig it rather than cast it use an elastic band to connect it to the weight so as to give you a rotten bottom link and hang it off the main line from a swivel to stop/reduce line twist.

Any observations most welcome .

Regards
David

[sharpshooter]

David,

Yep, pretty similar to how i have been taught to do it.
I use a jig very similar to what you describe. Basicallt a posh bit of scap wood with a couple of nails hammered in it at the correct distance apart. I then cut the head off one of the nails and wrap a bit of tape around to prevent damage to the line.
Tie the hook on as desired, then tie a loose over hand knot in the line; pop the hook over the nail with the head on, and put the overhand knot over the nail with the head removed. pull the line tight and the over hand knot will form around the nail. Slip it off the top and pull it tight. Each snood will then be the same length.

SS

[m.b3]

anyone recommend feather for launce? gonna try makin up some on small size 12 freshwater hooks? any ideas what materials?

[sharpshooter]

anyone recommend feather for launce? gonna try makin up some on small size 12 freshwater hooks? any ideas what materials?

The hooks dont need to be that small. Size 6 will be fine. You will need to use 20lb line as a minimum or you will smash the set up if you get a string full of mackerel.

A couple of strands of tinsel, or a small bit pulled off a feather will be fine, but more simply, some coloured tubing pushed over the hook will work well. If you cant get theright size for a tight fit - use some shrink tube :)

SS

[David Gould]

Cut open a shiny foil crisp packet, coffee packet, etc. then cut into 20 mm wide strips and fold so the shiny side is out , then simply cut across the folded strip at about 45 degrees every 35 mm so as to give a strip that when opened out looks like an arrows flight feathers.

Use this folded strip over the hooks and whip on with 20 lb or more BS line as shown by Sharpshooters pictures ensure the long tail bit of the foil is curled over an edge to make it slightly curled ( after the whipping on )

Then with a 1.5 mtr length of heavy line (say 60 pounds or more ) form your first top loop using a figure of eight knot , then using the sort of knot I have shown add six or less feathers, then at a few inches below the point where the lowest hook reaches ( so you do not get a tangle of hook and loop ) tie off in a final figure of 8 that is big enough you to slip the line loop barrel hitch style over your weight etc.

At the top end of the rig body " barrel hitch " fit a heavy swivel to help reduce line twist imparted by the feathers and the sinker weight.


Tight lines and lots of them

David

[David Gould]

I have just spent a few minutes tying some size 5 hooks as feathers on 80 lb line ( rather thick ) and setting them on an 80 lb rig body of 1.5 mtr. long .
The knots were rather bulky and didn't snuggle /settle down to make a tidy knot.

After re looking at Sharpshooters diagrams and trying them I settled for the ones shown that I have developed in the attached pictures ( click on then to enlarge)

They might even be copyrighted some where but I couldn't find them .

Notes

The hook length has a two turn thumb knot as the stop knot ( a single one tends to open up on this thickness line)

The rig body setting point knot is also a two turn overhand knot

Spacings on the jig ( for left or right handed people.)

Hook line length to tied knot is the middle pin to the first pin on the right hand

Distance between attached hook length js is the total distance between the two sets of double pins.
So take care when making the jig so that the 2mm gap between the double pins is correct (too wide and the tied knot will slip through .


http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/th_20070430featherknots2019.jpg (http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070430featherknots2019.jpg)


http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/th_20070430featherknots2018.jpg (http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070430featherknots2018.jpg)

[sharpshooter]

I have just spent a few minutes tying some size 5 hooks as feathers on 80 lb line ( rather thick ) and setting them on an 80 lb rig body of 1.5 mtr. long .
The knots were rather bulky and didn't snuggle /settle down to make a tidy knot.

After re looking at Sharpshooters diagrams and trying them I settled for the ones shown that I have developed in the attached pictures ( click on then to enlarge)

They might even be copyrighted some where but I couldn't find them .

Notes

The hook length has a two turn thumb knot as the stop knot ( a single one tends to open up on this thickness line)

The rig body setting point knot is also a two turn overhand knot

Spacings on the jig ( for left or right handed people.)

Hook line length to tied knot is the middle pin to the first pin on the right hand

Distance between attached hook length js is the total distance between the two sets of double pins.
So take care when making the jig so that the 2mm gap between the double pins is correct (too wide and the tied knot will slip through .


http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/th_20070430featherknots2019.jpg (http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070430featherknots2019.jpg)


http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/th_20070430featherknots2018.jpg (http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070430featherknots2018.jpg)



David.

Tying a single overhand knot keeps the overal knot as slim line as possible. I will not open on heavy mono if you pull it tight properly. I regularly tie makerel feathers with 150lb mono - much thicker than 80lb - and have no troubles like you describle. If you use a jig as previously mentioned you can pull the knot nice and tight.

I only use a single overhand on the main line to again reduce the size of the finished knot and to minimise damage to the main line. There are massive strains placed on the sets i tie as they are used on hydraulic powered reels - very unforgiving. The more turns, the weaker the line will become IMHO; and obviously it is much more time consuming to use two turns when you are tying 30 snoods onto 6+metres of mono.

When using heavy mono; make sure the "pins" in the jig are strong enough. The mainone at the end which takes the hook - i use a coach bolt; which will not pull out. The second pin, to form the overhand stopper knot, is a slighter nail with the head cut off, so the knot can be slid off the top.

SS

[David Gould]

Thanks SS,
I suspect that the " BILL FISHER " 80 lb test line is my problem ( it is a hard line and very good for rock fishing as shock leaders ) then as the single turn thumb knot creeps loose after a few flicks of the fingernail even though I have pulled it tight on a strong masonry pin at the hook end and with pliers at the tag end .

I may have not viewed the attached pictures you gave of how you tie the hook lengths/snoods to the rig body correctly .Can you do a better and larger picture of the small ones you attached as it was the size of the knot I made using my view/ understanding of your pictures that made me seek other ways ?

Regards David

[m.b3]

cheers for advice lads...

have tried the crisp fiol b4 but reckon tubing is easier! will try. thanks...

[David Gould]

SharpShooter.

I have managed to expand the picture you showed and hopefully redrawn it correctly ...is this drawing correct ?

Click on it to get "the Big Picture ".


http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/th_20070503feathersknots003.jpg (http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070503feathersknots003.jpg)



Regards David

[sharpshooter]

SharpShooter.

I have managed to expand the picture you showed and hopefully redrawn it correctly ...is this drawing correct ?

Click on it to get "the Big Picture ".


http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/th_20070503feathersknots003.jpg (http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070503feathersknots003.jpg)



Regards David



David,

Thats is spot on - much better than my drawing effort :clap3:

You can get away with fewer turns on the blood knot at the bottom i usually use 2 although sometimes with very heavy mono (150lb) i use one turn.

the hooks i mentioned in the PM are shown in the pic attatched. Mustad "square haddock" 2363DT
I have loads if you want some i will be able to sort you some out pretty cheap :)
If you prefur the 5/0 i got you last time i have a few thousand left so thats no problem either, tho they are double the price of the 2363DT

I also have a whack of the same pattern mustad makkie hooks but spade end - if you are feeling adventurous lol - they are a little bit cheaper than the 2363DT

The "DT" stands for duratin, which is nearly, but not quite as corrosive than stainless; but lots cheaper :)

They are the same hooks as shown in my pis earlier in the thread; and the example i sent you a while back. I have a few k of the size 16 which are the size bigger if you prefur, although they do work out a little more£.

Try using the triplefish mono for the makerel gear. Light years better than anything else i have tried - and i i have tried loads of different lines. Tis getting more and more exspencive, and harder to get hold of, so am trying Momoi Hi-Catch as soon as i can get hold of some - taking a few weeks to import it :( will let you know what its like as soon as i can bend some sets together with it and hand them out as free-bees to local fishermen to try so i can get some feedback.


Sharpy

Edit: David, while you have been experimenting; i dont know if you have noticed that you need to put the snoodline through the overhand knot on the mainline the same way, or the snood points the opposite way. Very hard to explain. If; when the overhand knot in the mainline is pulled tight the snood wants to go the wrong way, take it out and poke it through from the other side or underneath.

As always; dont be afraid to get in touch with any Q's - i know i'm not very good at explaining things - would be much better to show you really, but that is not really practical lol

[David Gould]

Thanks for your speedy reply Sharp Shooter.
I did discover the bit about you saying snood follows the lie of the thumb knot,
I''ll see if I can redraw it correctly and then remove the incorrect picture once you tell me I have got things right..

Which end of the rig is best to attach the weights from looking at the drawing ( so I can put that down as attach weight to left /right side ).

I have been using a modified nail knot with a thin brass tube as the nail ( feed the line tag back down the tube ) I have managed some very fancy feathers indeed , I think that spade end hooks would work well if whipped on with thick line and garnishings were fitted afterwards using a finer line to whip them on .Can you PM me with cost/quantity please.

Regards
David

[sharpshooter]

Sorry i could not get straight away David - had to nip down the chinese :)

As per your picture, the lead is to the left or if you like the last half hitch is tied at the top - above the overhand knot.

I usually always put a different colour or odd coloured hook at the bottom of each set so the user can quickly see which way round to rig it up.

It can be quite hard to master but once you have it sussed to can "nail knot" a hook in 10 seconds or so.

There is an easier way to attatched hooks to mainline - i dont use it myself but is used by other commercial hook tyers down here. I dont like it; so dont use it.

Basically - tie snoods as before. Put the stop knot on the snood through the overhand knot on the mainline and pull it tight. pull the snood so the two overhand knots are touching; then simply tie a hitch below and a hitch above the overhand knot on the mainline.

Might be worth playing with. It is ok with heavy mono; not sure about lighter line but should be ok??
It can work itself loose before the set is used resulting in the odd hook falling off - hence i dont use it. The blood knot tied in the way i use jams up and keeps the snood in place.

Just remember to always have the last half hitch at the top so when the line is lifted up with fish on, the snood is being pulled down and pulling the knot tight, rather than the other way and you wont go far wrong.

All the hooks i get are in boxes of 1,000; containing 10 boxes of 100.
I'll work out the price for a box (100) for each type and get back to you as soon as i can.


SS

[David Gould]

Sharpshooter would you re look at the pictures and see if the two that you use are correct ( I'll then remove my other threads)
For all you guys who are contemplating making your own feathers there are lots of other weird and wonderful knots to use including one that you actually make a loop and then attach the hook direct to the cut loop.

See if you can use any of these styles of knots to make up sets of feathers in 3's right up to 8's (if you are dunking off a boat or pier etc.into deep water.

I tend to use 60 pound ( lb) 27 kilo (kg ) line for both rig body & hook lengths but have come unstuck once or twice when I have snagged a couple of the hooks in to kelp or rocks .
Thankfully I have only lost hooks, leaders , weights and a swivel as my main rod line usually parts at the grinner attaching it to the shock leader.

I prefer to use the heavier line on the hooks so that they do not tangle up into the rig body line as much as when you use thin 15 lb - 30 line for them.

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070504feathersknots003.jpg

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070504feathersknots002.jpg

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070504feathersknots001.jpg


http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070503feathersknots003.jpg


http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070430featherknots2018.jpg

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070425Featherknots004.jpg

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070425Featherknots003.jpg

[EoinMag]

I'll be out all next week fishing on holidays in Cork, so I hope to get this testing done then that I said I'll do.

[portlandjon]

I had great success using strips of Walkers crisps packets a few years ago. I found the red ones to be slightly better but all flavours worked well.

Jon

[sharpshooter]

I had great success using strips of Walkers crisps packets a few years ago. I found the red ones to be slightly better but all flavours worked well.

Jon

good old ready salted :)

Red is by far the most popular colour. Many of the guys i supply will only use all red gear.
Strange when you think that red is one of the first colours to diappear underwater.

SS

[sharpshooter]

David - pics are great - well done :)

No1 and number 3 are the ones i'm familiar with, but they would all work well i imagine.

I see on the diagram of the jig for spacing the hooks you have two nails close together to measure the distance.

On my version of the same kinda jig; i have the two nails already mentioned - one for the hook, one for the knot to be tied around.
I have another single nail further down the board - again with the head cut off. This one is to form the overhand knot in the mainline to distance the hooks the same. When tying the ready tied snoods to the mainline, the firsthook is tied on, then hooked onto the hook nail, and a knot is formed around the last nail to space the hooks; so basically the distance between the hook nail and the latter one is the distance required between hooks + the length of the snood (allowing a little for the knot.

I dont use this method anymore as i prefur to leave the last hitch loose, and the above method requires the knot to be pulled tight fully.
Feedback from fishermen has told me the snoods last much longer when they are pulled tight by the fish - when the line is submerged rather than by me before hand.
so
Now i have a long bit of string with knots in say 25cm apart spread between the gate post and washing line and i tie thye hooks on using the knotted line as a measure. Obviously this is not necessary with short sets for angling, but makes life much easier when tying on 30 hooks to a set over 7m long.

SS

Oh - David you have PM

[obe1]

I do mine similar to this

http://img474.imageshack.us/img474/974/tyingfeathersjq0.jpg

The only difference is I thread my line through the eye (front to back) instead of using spade hooks.
You can experiment with different colours or materials.

Hope it helps

Joe.

[David Gould]

OBE 1.
I tie mine from the barb end and use a thin brass tube 75 mm long to pass the loop back through the turns , that way it is easy to hold hook , decorations and line in the left hand to retain whipping and use your right to make the whipping .... each whip with feathers and decorations takes about 9 seconds.

Sharpshooter,
Having made a few dozen sets of 4's and 6's I removed the right hand pin from the
right hand set of two pins and have done as you
ie. used it as a stop knot former / hook length setting point.

Thanks for the info it is good to know that two practical people miles apart can come up with the same sort of idea independently of each other.

I have been playing with the slipknot to attach the hook lengths using your favoured method of attaching .... That is quick and so far under dry load testing I can pull 60 pounds strain on the 80 lb rig body without failure of the main rig body . My hooks are opening up at 34 lb ( ish.)

I reckon I'd be smiling from ear to ear if I could hook into that weight of fish even spread over 6 hooks and get them boated .

Here are some piccis I have recently taken showing how I tie on my " feathering "hooks , it works for spade ends as well .

CLICK ON A PICTURE TO ENLARGE.


http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/th_20070508tyingafeather007.jpg (http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070508tyingafeather007.jpg)

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/th_20070508tyingafeather005.jpg (http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070508tyingafeather005.jpg)

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/th_20070508tyingafeather004.jpg (http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070508tyingafeather004.jpg)

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/th_20070508tyingafeather003.jpg (http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070508tyingafeather003.jpg)

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/th_20070508tyingafeather002.jpg (http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g24/Misterdavid/20070508tyingafeather002.jpg)

Ok so they are in reverse order but it gives you a flavour of it all.

I have a pair of "FACOM " (£24 a pair) mole type grips with a smooth face at the jaw tip which are screwed down on to a " T " shaped bit of timber this is then clamped to a table and gives me a second pair of hands out away from the table edge. I grip the tail of the hook length in them and pull gently on the long bit I will use to attach the feather to the rig body, this tightened up the seven turns of the whipping , I then release the grips and set the hook length stop knot , put this stop knot end in the grips this time and using a key ring gently pull the hook till the whipping settles snugly and firm up against the eye /spade end .

As it was easier for you to see without any embellishments I have included one of the crisp packet foil ones so you can see what you can do . It is about 3 inches long ( 75 mm ) with a hook line length of about 125 mm ( 5 inches )

Earlier on I said I was using an arrow flight type shape for the foil ...well quite by one alcohol glass too many of Bushmills Black Label night , I happened to snip the foil so that the attaching end was more like a cricket bat handle shape ..... 1/3 of the width of the foil strip by about a 10 mm long handle ....with this folded down the length it fits very well over the hook shank and whips on fabulously , you can either have it upper most to show all the hook or down to hide most of the hook .


It all looks difficult but after six or seven goes it becomes very simple and easy .

David

[obe1]

Cheers David I will give that a go, I have a length of plastic tubing I can use for now until I find a metal one.

Joe.

[David Gould]

Cheers David I will give that a go, I have a length of plastic tubing I can use for now until I find a metal one.

Joe.

Joe . I did use the red tube from a can of WD 40 but eventually its walls collapsed .

The tube is from B&Q in the metal rack , ca £1.58 per metre , the beads are super glued on the tube just to stop it sliding through my fingers ( some days they don't work like the youth I once was ).

David

[solehunter]

A faultless method of making feathers is to simply wrap silver foil around your hook shanks.

[David Gould]

A faultless method of making feathers is to simply wrap silver foil around your hook shanks.


solehunter

Foil on the hooks , sadly they don't last long if your casting from high rocks down into the sea and a fair way out ...the foil often falls off. They also tend to get trashed is you get fish on the hooks. Jigging from a boat is perhaps best with big feathers ,attractors rather than just something less than the size of your hook

Simply wrapping foil on the hook hook is about as effective as using silver hooks I suspect .

If you try and form the foil to a fish shape then it all goes to rats if you fish as in the first paragraph .

Can you put up a picture and let us know the fishing method etc.

[sharpshooter]

Cheers David I will give that a go, I have a length of plastic tubing I can use for now until I find a metal one.

Joe.

Five turns is the most i ever do; more usually 3 or 4 and with real heavy mono - two is fine - you dont need the plastic tube. I have never used a tube i think it is much quicker and easier without.

SS

[David Gould]

Five turns is the most i ever do; more usually 3 or 4 and with real heavy mono - two is fine - you dont need the plastic tube. I have never used a tube i think it is much quicker and easier without.

SS

Booo Hoo :kissing: SS you have pinkies that seem to work most of the time , I have three left hands and still tie with a right hand one :) The bust up left shoulder is also a little problem I had to overcome to tie my feathers as my left hand does not have much rotation ( :secret: The tube stays for me )

I found that tying the crisp packet /coffee packet/tea bag shiny plastic and bits needs 6 turns to hold it on the hook to allow for a few fish catches other wise it often comes off ...however those snazzy red and yellow peril feathers you do, would most certainly only need a few turns like you say.
I also found the same for using true feathers to make the lures ... 6 turns is ideal

[sharpshooter]

Booo Hoo :kissing: SS you have pinkies that seem to work most of the time , I have three left hands and still tie with a right hand one :) The bust up left shoulder is also a little problem I had to overcome to tie my feathers as my left hand does not have much rotation ( :secret: The tube stays for me )

I found that tying the crisp packet /coffee packet/tea bag shiny plastic and bits needs 6 turns to hold it on the hook to allow for a few fish catches other wise it often comes off ...however those snazzy red and yellow peril feathers you do, would most certainly only need a few turns like you say.
I also found the same for using true feathers to make the lures ... 6 turns is ideal

PSSSSST - David! Get some MYLAR TUBE and some florists ribbon (super red)- torn into thin strips or, CURLING RIBBON (4.5mm) It is very durable stuff. Talking to a fisherman i supply gear to yesturday and he said he had 150stone of makkies on one set of 20hooks before the dressing wore away :) As the dressing is so tough, you can just tie it with just a few turns; this also gives the ribbon more movement, rather than it being tied along the length of the hook shank. Cost per hook? about 3p. (2.8p of which is the mylar tube)
The MYLAR is great stuff, but will wear away long before the ribbon. Sets made with the ribbon alone still fish very well.

SS

[lobbit]

solehunter

Foil on the hooks , sadly they don't last long if your casting from high rocks down into the sea and a fair way out ...the foil often falls off. They also tend to get trashed is you get fish on the hooks. Jigging from a boat is perhaps best with big feathers ,attractors rather than just something less than the size of your hook

Simply wrapping foil on the hook hook is about as effective as using silver hooks I suspect .

If you try and form the foil to a fish shape then it all goes to rats if you fish as in the first paragraph .

Can you put up a picture and let us know the fishing method etc.

but with foil so readily available and free with most pkts of crisps and cigarettes does that matter ,simply load another lot onto the hook ,you can get a good bag of fish before they fall apart even expensive traces get wrecked .
ive cut a beer can up into strips and wrapped that mackies love the idea of free tennants btw

[obe1]

PSSSSST - David! Get some MYLAR TUBE and some florists ribbon (super red)- torn into thin strips or, CURLING RIBBON (4.5mm) It is very durable stuff. Talking to a fisherman i supply gear to yesturday and he said he had 150stone of makkies on one set of 20hooks before the dressing wore away :) As the dressing is so tough, you can just tie it with just a few turns; this also gives the ribbon more movement, rather than it being tied along the length of the hook shank. Cost per hook? about 3p. (2.8p of which is the mylar tube)
The MYLAR is great stuff, but will wear away long before the ribbon. Sets made with the ribbon alone still fish very well.

SS

sharpshooter, what is mylar tube?

[sinkingslowly]

PSSSSST - David! Get some MYLAR TUBE and some florists ribbon (super red)- torn into thin strips or, CURLING RIBBON (4.5mm) It is very durable stuff. Talking to a fisherman i supply gear to yesturday and he said he had 150stone of makkies on one set of 20hooks before the dressing wore away :) As the dressing is so tough, you can just tie it with just a few turns; this also gives the ribbon more movement, rather than it being tied along the length of the hook shank. Cost per hook? about 3p. (2.8p of which is the mylar tube)
The MYLAR is great stuff, but will wear away long before the ribbon. Sets made with the ribbon alone still fish very well.

SS

Sharpshooter, I have been using parcel ribbon for some time as its cheap and multicoloured (not that the colour matters but it makes a change), but where can I get silver Mylar tube at a sensible price?
I'm not going to buy at tackle shops as I know they just cut it off a roll and multiply the price x10!

[sharpshooter]

sharpshooter, what is mylar tube?

See the pics - Not very good i'm afraid.
Mylar is basically the stuff known as silver shrimp - kind of braided tinsel if you like.

SS

[sharpshooter]

Sharpshooter, I have been using parcel ribbon for some time as its cheap and multicoloured (not that the colour matters but it makes a change), but where can I get silver Mylar tube at a sensible price?
I'm not going to buy at tackle shops as I know they just cut it off a roll and multiply the price x10!

Had the same trouble myself. I now buy wholesale - 100m at a time and get it at a much better price; but still more than i want to pay for it really.
This stuff comes from a fly tying factory. It is the best stuff i have ever seen, certainly ever used. light years better than the stuff used on shop bought silver shrimp sets. The two are not even comparable with regards to quality.

You can get cheaper versions from habberdashery shops - the kind that sell buttons and elastic etc etc. It is nothing like as good; but far cheaper; and would be fine for light angling use.
For commercial purposes i need the tighter weave and general higher quality to make the sets last.

SS

[obe1]

See the pics - Not very good i'm afraid.
Mylar is basically the stuff known as silver shrimp - kind of braided tinsel if you like.

SS

Cheers sharpshooter, I will look out for that and give it a go.

Joe.