got myself a rod and reel ready for my hols down in newquay and loaded the reel with 15lb mainline and a tapered shock leader,my probably most stupid question is how much leader should actually be on the reel when ready to cast,as i,m a freshwater chap,when i fish normally,a shock leader would go around the spool about 1/2 a dozen times,but this tapered thing if i were to cut it back,{15to45lb bs}would reduce the strength or dont it really need cutting back?its actually 13 metres.also when ledgering,if fiishing paternoster style,do you tie the ledger to the end of the shockleader,if so that would mean tieing hook lengths onto the shock leader as well, or is it just best to fish a running ledger,thanks in advance chaps.
a few simple questions
1 - 19 of 19 Posts
Joined
·
318 Posts
How long it will need to be depends on the length of the rod and where you're fishing. It generally needs to be around 2 rod lengths to allow for the casting drop and a least 6 tuns on the reel. Some people will use a longer leader when fishing from high areas like pier, breakwaters or high ledges to give something strong to lift the fish up with.
Normally a clip is tied to the end of the leader to allow a rig to be clipped on ( you can tie direct but each time you do this the leader will get shorter)
Normally a clip is tied to the end of the leader to allow a rig to be clipped on ( you can tie direct but each time you do this the leader will get shorter)
Joined
·
5,246 Posts
Hi mate, I've never used the tapered leaders but i wouldnt reccomend cutting them back coz this WILL reduce the stregth, if you use it like a normal shockleader you would probably only be using 20lb max. You should be looking to use 10lb per ounce of lead.Just use it as it comes after all that 13meters will be gone in 2 seconds off your spool so it isnt going to make that much difference in your casts.
As was said in the previous reply all rigs should be made with a swivel at the top so this can either be attached straight to the shockleader or to a rig clip,which makes it easier to clip/unclip rigs. This method is mainly used by match fishermen though when a bait is needed in the water for the most amount of time as possible. If your just pleasure fishing you can just tie the swivel straight to the shockleader. If your not up to making the rigs just go and buy a few from the local tackle shop, just make sure they are quality rigs and not just some cheap one desinged for the tourist:uhuh: Greys and mustad do well made ready made rigs. Hope you have a good holiday and cach lots of fish. PM me if you need anymore info on rigs etc
Joined
·
424 Posts
First of all, I understand from the above that you're using 15lb mainline (which is fine) with a 45lb tapered shockleader. You would not cut a tapered shockleader; you would just tie the thin end to the mainline using a blood knot (you probably already know how to tie it, but just in case you don't here is a link that demonstrates it: http://www.sea-fishing.org/fishing-blood-knot.html]).
BUT - what casting style and what weight of lead are you using? For anything other than a basic 'overhead thump', with the arc of the rod travelling throughout the cast in the same direction as that in which the lead will hit the water, the golden rule is 10lb breaking strain for every ounce of lead used. So, unless you are using 4oz leads, and/or are using a very basic style of casting, you need to uprate that shockleader to 50lb (preferably 60lb, if you may be using 6oz leads) breaking strain. It would be better, in fact, if you were to get into the habit of using such a leader, ready for when your casting style progresses.
Secondly, Rigs are made up or purchased as seperate units. The main body of the rig - that which runs from the leader to the lead - should be of at least the same breaking strain as the former. Hook lengths, or snoods, are attached to the rig body. You need to visit the Shore Rigs pages of the main WSF website to see how these are constructed, and the Shore Species section for a guide to which to choose.
It's as much about safety as it is about effective fishing - and it's imperative that you get the former right!
Don't hesitate to post here if you need more advice.
Tight lines,
John
Joined
·
424 Posts
Pugs,
It gradually tapers from around .35mm diameter/15lb breaking strain to the diameter and breaking strain of the actual leader section. If you cut any substantial amount from the heavier end then it will be too short to be safe, and if you cut it from the tapered end then it will no longer be close to the diameter of the main line.
However, in the latter case, provided there was enough leader proper left, you could join it using a standard leader knot, which is used to join lines of differing thickneses. Here is a link showing how to tie it: http://neilmackellow.sea-angler.org/knot5.html.
I can't see any reason for shortening a tapered leader other than the thin end becoming worn while enough undamaged leader remained so as not to affect safety.
Cheers,
John
Joined
·
21,232 Posts
i noticed a reference to using a blood knot for tying the leader.imo this knot can fail or slip,a lot better knot is the leader knot,slightly more difficult but easy to learn
http://neilmackellow.sea-angler.org/knot5.html
http://neilmackellow.sea-angler.org/knot5.html
thanks for that, i actually went to buy a 60lb leader,but on advice from the bloke in tackle shop he
said that with a tapered leader ,it will keep the leader to the mainline double blood knot to a minimum size without it impairing castingi would agree that tapered leaders give a smaller knot than non tapered, but the strength is far worse.
if you use a multi with a level wind you might have to go for a tapered. if using a CT multi or fixed spool then a normal leader will be better. i've never had a leader knot catch on a rod ring before, when the knot passes through the rings there is no angle for the knot to catch.
you can get more weed collecting on the knot on the retrieve though, then you might have to handline fish up the pier/ beach.
there are pro's and cons to both but IMO there are mor pro's for the normal leader than tapered.
if you use a multi with a level wind you might have to go for a tapered. if using a CT multi or fixed spool then a normal leader will be better. i've never had a leader knot catch on a rod ring before, when the knot passes through the rings there is no angle for the knot to catch.
you can get more weed collecting on the knot on the retrieve though, then you might have to handline fish up the pier/ beach.
there are pro's and cons to both but IMO there are mor pro's for the normal leader than tapered.
i noticed a reference to using a blood knot for tying the leader.imo this knot can fail or slip,a lot better knot is the leader knot,slightly more difficult but easy to learn
http://neilmackellow.sea-angler.org/knot5.html
Not for tapered leader, that knot that you show isn't as suited to similar diameter line which is what you're aiming for with tapered leader to give a more streamlined knot profile.
I use tapered leaders you don't want to chop them shorter, but they can take losing a few feet off them, each time you retie it you lose a bit but the end bit is low diameter for quite a distance. The tapered leaders I use are 13m long so there's a lot of line wrapped around the fixed spool or the multiplier, cos of the lower breaking strain towards the end.
Joined
·
2,113 Posts
Which newquay? If its Cornwall then your more than welcome to give me a shout
thanks for that bigman,definitely your newquay mate,going down end of may for 10 days and stopping @riverside at lane.fancy having a go on flycellars where i usually go sit and watch while the wifes looking round *******shops,but know it gets busy there so might go and try and find somewhere quieter where i can only embarrass myself!
Joined
·
2,639 Posts
It is o.k. to cut small amounts off 13m long tapered leaders :-
provided there are still half-a-dozen turns of the thick section of the line around your reel spool when you are ready to cast (unless you are using a very long rod, you can gradually cut up to about 3 or 4 m off the thick end when tackling down) before that stops being true
and you don't cut back the thin end more than a metre or two (to the point where it starts getting significantly thicker) - you can still use it if you had to do that, but you are losing the advantage of the taper - you might as well use plain, strong mono and a leader knot.
for lines of the same diameter (main line and thin end of the leader) a blood knot is good - provided you can tie it well (test it with a fairly heavy pull, after tying).
If the tag ends catch weed, you can reduce that by actually leaving them longer (about 20mm or 3/4 of an inch instead of about 3mm 1/8th of an inch) - they bend over more easily then - or you can trim them as close as you dare (making sure the knot has been pulled really tight before you do). Or you can switch to a uni-uni knot
provided there are still half-a-dozen turns of the thick section of the line around your reel spool when you are ready to cast (unless you are using a very long rod, you can gradually cut up to about 3 or 4 m off the thick end when tackling down) before that stops being true
and you don't cut back the thin end more than a metre or two (to the point where it starts getting significantly thicker) - you can still use it if you had to do that, but you are losing the advantage of the taper - you might as well use plain, strong mono and a leader knot.
for lines of the same diameter (main line and thin end of the leader) a blood knot is good - provided you can tie it well (test it with a fairly heavy pull, after tying).
If the tag ends catch weed, you can reduce that by actually leaving them longer (about 20mm or 3/4 of an inch instead of about 3mm 1/8th of an inch) - they bend over more easily then - or you can trim them as close as you dare (making sure the knot has been pulled really tight before you do). Or you can switch to a uni-uni knot
Joined
·
3,147 Posts
The centrifugal force from a larger standerd leader knot is greater than with a tapered leader. If you run a fasr reel the line can rise rapidly from the spool and the knot can cause the line to loop over the butt ring.
Tapered leaders cause less problems.
Joined
·
2,639 Posts
one time you might have to cut a tapered leader off when it is still in good nick is if a lot of weed (too fine to shake or pluck off the line) has gathered on the main line and been pushed (by the tip ring) down to that knot.
The same applies to a non-tapered leader:- sometimes the easiest way to get rid of the weed is to cut at the leader knot, slide it off the reel line and re-tie.
and to those who say "use level line right through" (strong enough, of course) I say sometime the rally fine "grass" weed can jam up on your level, un-knotted line ...... with the lead (and fish) still 30 yards away ! It just collects enough so it cannot be slid ! :blink: In fact it can grip so hard it won't even slide on slippery superbraid !
Sorry if this is getting too detailed for a "beginners & " forum
1 - 19 of 19 Posts
