World Sea Fishing Forums banner
41 - 60 of 65 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,252 Posts
The sea trout is the biggest tragedy in salmon farming. Lice from farmed fish wiped out the Northwestern Irish stocks, the most prolific in the world in, only a few years, and they're doing it here now as they have in Scotland. Scandinavian countries are going to label farmed salmon as containing chemicals dangerous to health, and recommended limits on consumption
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
288 Posts
Once again twisting words,

You said they favour "traditional rod and line over fish farming" not commercial rod and line. Had you said commercial rod and line you would not be including recreational angling and the right for the public to freely harvest seafood.

You can only pull the wool over the eyes of people who do not wish to see.
Mate this makes no sense. Why are you bringing up recreational angling on a salmon farming thread ?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,252 Posts
If we want to talk about wild atlantic salmon, recreational anglers have played a large part in the destruction of stocks, over a long time period. There should be no fisheries for them other than C&R. It's easy to blame netting and climate change etc, but rod fisheries exploit fish surviving to their parent river and thus magnifying their effect
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
785 Posts
Many years (20+) ago i worked in a factory making fish pellets for the fish framing industry. The thing that shocked me most was the colouring used to make the salmon pink. Back then I was told it was £150,000 a ton. It had a horrible effect on the equipment we installed. Part of the process is to steam the mix of fishmeal, fishoil, etc which means you get lots of colouring floating around in the air. The beige coloured equipment we installed soon turned orange. Interestingly, along with various recipes including chemicals to kill sea lice, one of the recipes used garlic which was supposed to have a similar effect.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
410 Posts
Many years (20+) ago i worked in a factory making fish pellets for the fish framing industry. The thing that shocked me most was the colouring used to make the salmon pink. Back then I was told it was £150,000 a ton. It had a horrible effect on the equipment we installed. Part of the process is to steam the mix of fishmeal, fishoil, etc which means you get lots of colouring floating around in the air. The beige coloured equipment we installed soon turned orange. Interestingly, along with various recipes including chemicals to kill sea lice, one of the recipes used garlic which was supposed to have a similar effect.
I worked in a feedmill producing feed for poultry and pigs. We had all sorts of oddball ingredients. Does the fishfeed industry have the equivalent of a Roche Colour Fan? - match the shade of yellow of the egg yolk, identify the colour you want, look up the table to see what needs to be added to the feed and in what quantity. I imagine there'd be something similar for salmon flesh colour.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,654 Posts
I worked in a feedmill producing feed for poultry and pigs. We had all sorts of oddball ingredients. Does the fishfeed industry have the equivalent of a Roche Colour Fan? - match the shade of yellow of the egg yolk, identify the colour you want, look up the table to see what needs to be added to the feed and in what quantity. I imagine there'd be something similar for salmon flesh colour.
No doubt you to be spot on.
Why pigs need to eat fish i will to never know. Pigs do not fish. You can to taste it into the meat too.
Fish farms are madness personified. Lower quality food, bad for the environment, and more effort and expense put in overall than fishing directly for them. Why to bother.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,212 Posts
No doubt you to be spot on.
Why pigs need to eat fish i will to never know. Pigs do not fish. You can to taste it into the meat too.
Fish farms are madness personified. Lower quality food, bad for the environment, and more effort and expense put in overall than fishing directly for them. Why to bother.
Why Bacon tastes Garbage!. We used to feed pigs swill boiled up veg and other bits they used to go mad for it when feeding time on our farm.
But EU said No.Non.Nein so they get fed non pig food like Mashed up sand ells etc and ive yet to see pigs hunting fish!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
21,674 Posts
I worked in a feedmill producing feed for poultry and pigs. We had all sorts of oddball ingredients. Does the fishfeed industry have the equivalent of a Roche Colour Fan? - match the shade of yellow of the egg yolk, identify the colour you want, look up the table to see what needs to be added to the feed and in what quantity. I imagine there'd be something similar for salmon flesh colour.
:)In the early 60's I worked in the Rank feed mill in Stroud Glos. and what went into the feed was very interesting but nothing untoward. The chicken feed was something to see. Occasionally a Vets. prescription meant that anti biotics were added to chicken or pig food but all bags were labelled with instructions for use. I'm sure the eggs were better than free range as they had loads of healthy additives that the chickens wouldn't normally find in a field. I've watched a couple of programmes on salmon farming so I no longer eat farmed salmon, not because of what they are fed but because of the inhumane way they are treated and the damage the farms do to the environment. There are many rules and regulations for salmon farming but according to the programmes they are ignored so as to make more profit and the catching of wrasse from the south coast and transporting them to Scotland is inexcusable and should have been banned years ago. The AT and Fish Legal, their legal arm, promised to stop it but so far no result. 😩
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
410 Posts
Why pigs need to eat fish i will to never know
Cheap protein. Pigs (and chickens) are omnivorous. At one time poultry offal. meat and bone meal, feather meal and a variety of other ingredients you don't want to know about would have been used. That got knocked on the head by Salmonella, BSE, and other human health issues directly attributed to these materials and how they were handled. Now the protein fraction is pretty much limited to fishmeal and soya. Neither are particularly good for the environment. Insect and worm protein have been investigated and trialled, but unless fishmeal/soya are priced/regulated out they won't scale up.

In the early 60's I worked in the Rank feed mill in Stroud Glos. and what went into the feed was very interesting but nothing untoward. The chicken feed was something to see. Occasionally a Vets. prescription meant that anti biotics were added to chicken or pig food but all bags were labelled with instructions for use. I'm sure the eggs were better than free range as they had loads of healthy additives that the chickens wouldn't normally find in a field.
We were doing just shy of 10k tonnes/week of mixed pig and poultry feed around the turn of the millennium The ingredients had been cleaned up since the bad old days of the 80s/90s. But I still avoid pig liver. AGPs had just been knocked on the head, but pigs were routinely being dosed with some very complex cocktails of PMLs/POMs.

_
I'm amused by the view of traditional farming mentioned by someone else further up the thread. Intensive pig and poultry rearing can be almost as damaging to local environments as salmon farming. If you think your breakfast bacon was free-roaming in a field, you're sadly mistaken.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,654 Posts
Why Bacon tastes Garbage!. We used to feed pigs swill boiled up veg and other bits they used to go mad for it when feeding time on our farm.
But EU said No.Non.Nein so they get fed non pig food like Mashed up sand ells etc and ive yet to see pigs hunting fish!
Do you to talk from kitchen scraps?
I can to understand to an extent the logic behind the non kitchen scrap rule. But it to fly into the face of the reason of salmonella etc when you do to think humans to be eating the food that does to turn into scraps anyway!
I to remember the first few pork joints we did to eat as a family late 80s early 90s that did to be fed onto fish meal. Rank. I to no longer eat pork or bacon unless i to know where it to be from and what it did to be fed. A shame as it did to be my favorite meat.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,654 Posts
Cheap protein. Pigs (and chickens) are omnivorous.
Not quite what i did to mean though. You to never see a wild boar with a net or fishing rod, so while it may to be a protein source to feed them, it to not be what they to eat into the wild unless they to live nesr the coast and to scavenge from beached fish.
Same as cat and dog food, though i to be guilty of it myself. (Not that we to eat them)
A cat to catch a trout or salmon, yes i can to see it might be possible. But cod and haddock?!
We should to be feeding livestock their proper diets. Perhaps if we did to do that there would not to be the health issues and diseases we to find nowadays.

Regardless how you can to justify to cage a fish, then to catch a fish to feed it- then mince it up and to add fillers to it so it to not even be minced fish anymore, then to feed it to the fish as if it to be natural is boggling.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
410 Posts
We should to be feeding livestock their proper diets.
I did address that. Vermiculture and insect culture could produce a more natural diet (and have been approved for fish feed by the EU). But fishmeal and soya are cheap.

I've also been involved with an indoor aquaponic fishfarm. It's viable for some species, but very few of them are traditional eating species in Western Europe. They still require massive feed inputs relative to the meat output, and the feed is fishmeal based. They're also very vulnerable to the whims of supermarket supply chains when it comes to scaling up.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,654 Posts
I did address that. Vermiculture and insect culture could produce a more natural diet (and have been approved for fish feed by the EU). But fishmeal and soya are cheap.

I've also been involved with an indoor aquaponic fishfarm. It's viable for some species, but very few of them are traditional eating species in Western Europe. They still require massive feed inputs relative to the meat output, and the feed is fishmeal based. They're also very vulnerable to the whims of supermarket supply chains when it comes to scaling up.
Cheap does not to justify it George, as you to know.
Aquaponics does not to work well on big scales for the same reasons as above. Too easy to cut corners. Small scale it does to work fine with a realisation protein with aquaponics is to never be a constant. But then we to be omnivores and not to need protein every day anyway.
It to be about time natural diets did to be aknowledged. The realities do need to be addressed. Too much money is made adding plastics and carp into food we eat, or to feed the food we to eat. Or to over eating.
If a sustainable existence is to happen, we do need to get back to reality. Food is fuel. It can to be made to taste nice though good cooking, but bottom line is it is fuel. Nothing more.
Cut additives and sugar and salt into our diet, and our health will to improve drastically.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
410 Posts
To reduce food to fuel, is to reduce angling for anything other than the table to a waste of energy and effort. It's an over-simplistic viewpoint that ignores the pleasure that can be derived from food, and from eating. Eating is a social experience as well as a functional one.

Mass produced food goes hand-in-hand with high density living, and criticising pre-processed food is is a middle class luxury. The reality is that many people work long hours for low pay and don't have the time to cook - or to shop for fresh ingredients. We're domestic skills poor as a nation, with far too many people uneducated in basic cooking and housekeeping skills. This had started to turn around in the 90s, but changes of government and changes in priority reversed the progress made through Sure Start and investment in school kitchens.

If you want a large-scale return to a 'natural diet' you'll need to join the forum brown shirts and their plans for population culling.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,654 Posts
To reduce food to fuel, is to reduce angling for anything other than the table to a waste of energy and effort. It's an over-simplistic viewpoint that ignores the pleasure that can be derived from food, and from eating. Eating is a social experience as well as a functional one.

Mass produced food goes hand-in-hand with high density living, and criticising pre-processed food is is a middle class luxury. The reality is that many people work long hours for low pay and don't have the time to cook - or to shop for fresh ingredients. We're domestic skills poor as a nation, with far too many people uneducated in basic cooking and housekeeping skills. This had started to turn around in the 90s, but changes of government and changes in priority and investment in school kitchens.

If you want a large-scale return to a 'natural diet' you'll need to join the forum brown shirts and their plans for population culling.
To curb, not cull the population to be sustainable is unfortunately where we will need to go into the future if we do to continue where how we are without interplanetary travel or a vast change. It just to be one of those facts that are unavoidable. It is all ok to say we do to aim for sustainable living but it does to mean diddly squat when you to try to be sustainable into supporting what is unsustainable.
Hard conversations will to be had and hard eventualities will to be occurring at some point into the future, of that i am certain.
The alternative is to carry on as we go, to increase production for an ever increasing population, and at some point we will to find nature does take over for us, and restore the balance to below the carrying capacity of earth for our species. We will hit a time when the population cannot be sustained onto the resources we do have and the population will be controlled just as is does to do in nature in a continuous cycle. One can to argue with people alteady starving into the world we are already there.

Personally i would to prefer a curb onto population numbers with births, than to witness famines emacition and death onto a mass scale worldwide.

The simplistic fact to be that our food production here in the west at least can to be cut significantly into a more sustainable fashion now with a change in attitudes towards food.

That change in attitude would to also change much about western society which would to address your points of the working class to work to death to line the pockets of others, some of who to supply such carp food into the first place.
Right or wrongly i cannot to see a way how to avoid the following. In order to be sustainable into most and all things, capitalism does need to be overhauled, or scrapped. The idea of making the best of what you do to have is counter to the more more more of capitalist greed.
 
41 - 60 of 65 Posts
Top