World Sea Fishing Forums banner

1 - 20 of 31 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,400 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Real puzzler for me . What gives better presentation ?
I've been using 5' 120lb Tuna tough Mono and 6/0 Owner SSW hooks but get loads of dropped takes? Not sure wire would be any better? I dont want to damage the Topes gobs either but have heard of a few people being bitten off on thick mono. Please Help?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,139 Posts
after being bitten off on plwhelli beach last year by a tope i have made up some rigs with wire hooklengths but they are only 35lb breaking strain. the strength should be ok as long as they cant bite through the wire. as you have found out i didnt want to go to mega thick mono because of the poor presentation.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,986 Posts
Hi Barry think i was reading on site a week ago the same question,the answer was nylon coated wire combined with Cox & Rawle 10 o meat hooks,stand to be corrected but sure that was the end result
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
308 Posts
Personally wouldn't touch wire again, used it in the 70's/80's and 90's, converted over to mono 150lb - 200lb B/S and its far better
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
462 Posts
High quality modern stuff is ace. It is so fine and gives much better bait presentation than stiff heavy mono.
Dont get me wrong - i only use wire for tope; and then it is only a short length as described - unless of course targeting blues or progies but thats another story.

Dont use the nast plastic coated rubbish - get some decent stuff. Even if it is multi stranded i tie and twist - only using a crimp to cover the tag end.

Heavy mono all the way for eels or other preditors........
A decent tope is easily capable of biting through 200lb commercial grade mono. Their teeth are very sharp.

SS
I used to use wire, but a few years back a good friend and charter skipper Charlie Bartlett banned the use of wire on his boat( then Miss Claudia) This was due to the damage being done to the fish by wire.
35lb wire is very thin and during the fight can cut into the fish, heavy mono 250lb is around the 1.8mm mark and does considerably less damage.
We changed the way we hook the Mackerel baits, to just lip hooking through both lips, and this resulted in more hook ups.
Lots of people shy away from heavy mono because they can't tie it, this is no longer the case, I was having trouble tying it but invented a gadget to make it easier, type tracemate into google and have a look, alternatively there is a review on this site.
Gary
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
462 Posts
Sorry forgot to mention, over the last seven years we have not had one trace bitten through, and have landed loads of Tope, biggest being 72lb
We use Atlantic soft bought from www.uk-hooks.co.uk
Gary
 
T

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
100% with Tracemate and MerseyA here.

The thought of wire on my own teeth kind of puts me off, coupleed with the mdoern thin stuff and it's cheese wire effect on skin....

Over some 25 years of angling I've caught loads of Tope. I have never once been bitten off or found mono is any form of deterent.
Typically I'll use 200lb mono to an 8/0 ot 10/0 Cox and Rawle Meat Hook.
18" to 2 feet of trace line followed by a few feet of 80lb rubbing leader finishes off the rig. Fished on a standard flowing trace.

Very hypocryticaly, when fishing for sharks "proper" I'd never dream of not using wire, although I've caught a lot of baby Mako's and Blue's in the Canaries on Tope rigs.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
462 Posts
We used to use short traces and a rubbing length, but now partly to keep it simple, partly down to lazyness and partly down to buying 100m at a time, we use a standard running ledger with a 10/12ft trace of 200/250lb through to the hook.
If a fish damages the line by the hook, we just cut six inches off and re-tie the hook, this can be done several times.
Gary
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
21,236 Posts
ok,never fished for tope or the like,but instead of the mono or wire dabate,how about circle hooks as there is far less chance of there teeth being anywhere near the line/wire:unsure: :)
 
T

·
Guest
Joined
·
0 Posts
Blankerman quote "ok,never fished for tope or the like,but instead of the mono or wire dabate,how about circle hooks as there is far less chance of there teeth being anywhere near the line/wire"

I've never hooked a Tope anywhere other than in the scissors as you tend to hit it much sooner than may be imagined. Typically the Tope hasn't even turned the bait by the time the hook is set.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
462 Posts
Blankerman quote "ok,never fished for tope or the like,but instead of the mono or wire dabate,how about circle hooks as there is far less chance of there teeth being anywhere near the line/wire"

I've never hooked a Tope anywhere other than in the scissors as you tend to hit it much sooner than may be imagined. Typically the Tope hasn't even turned the bait by the time the hook is set.
Have to disagree with that, Out of Bradwell uptiding it is absolutely correct. But in Aberdovey where we have fished a week each year for 21 years now if you don't fish the classic Tope method you will not catch.
IE let the fish run, once it stops(and turns the bait) hit it as it runs again.
The only exception we have found is if the fish are finikey and we have to use fillets, then we hit them straight away.
Method will obviously differ from venue to venue, but there is still a chance the line or wire will be chaffed, evenusing a circle hook. For a circle hook to work the bait has to be inside the fishes jaws and be pulled to turn the hook into the scissors.
Circle hooks also make it more difficult to present the bait.
For me it's heavy mono and either 8/0 Cox and Rawle Meat Hook, or 8/0 bronzed o'shaughnessey(never stainless as there are times a hook has to be left in a fish)
Sounds like personal preference is the answer.
Gary
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
282 Posts
I always used to use a short wire bite backing onto a length of 80lb mono trace for tope, but then moved on to 200-250lb co-polymer mono for the whole trace. It knots easily and cleanly with no noticeable knot ruffle as seen with most cheap heavy monos when knotted. This worked great until I was bitten off by three tope in the one weekend when downtiding! Have now regressed to a short wire bite backing on to the 80lb co-polymer trace. I would advise anyone doing any serious regular downtide toping to do the same.
For uptide tope fishing, I alternate between wire/co-polymer and straight heavy co-polymer. I haven't had a bite through with the co-polymer only approach when uptiding, but my shot confidence hazards that it's probably only a matter of time. Circle hooks on the heavy co-polymer and slow hands may well be the most fool-proof answer.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
462 Posts
I always used to use a short wire bite backing onto a length of 80lb mono trace for tope, but then moved on to 200-250lb co-polymer mono for the whole trace. It knots easily and cleanly with no noticeable knot ruffle as seen with most cheap heavy monos when knotted. This worked great until I was bitten off by three tope in the one weekend when downtiding! Have now regressed to a short wire bite backing on to the 80lb co-polymer trace. I would advise anyone doing any serious regular downtide toping to do the same.
For uptide tope fishing, I alternate between wire/co-polymer and straight heavy co-polymer. I haven't had a bite through with the co-polymer only approach when uptiding, but my shot confidence hazards that it's probably only a matter of time. Circle hooks on the heavy co-polymer and slow hands may well be the most fool-proof answer.
Looks like we're back to personal preference. Never been bitten off. Prefer to use mono to avoid damage to the fish.
Gary
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
130 Posts
should be going out with Charlie at the end of this month,what are the chances of good tope ?and how does he feel about taking a few mackerel away for freezing ? only the second time out with Charlie and 4th time all together on a boat.i was tempted to order some circle hooks BUT i think im going with the cox and rawle meathooks.like tracemate said the way things get done on charlies boat are mono and hook the macks through the lips.

if you haven`t been on charlie`s boat i cant stress enough how much of a beast it really is :) oh and tracemate what do you mean by "turn the hook" ? thanks in advance.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
221 Posts
I use the same set-up as sharpshooter (short wire trace with (a longer) 6-7ft mono rubbing leader). The wire has never damaged the mouth of the tope (usually 75lb multistrand plastic coated stuff).

I personally don't think that tope are put off by any trace material. In my experience, when a lot of takes are being missed, it is usually down to small tope/big baits. Reducing the bait size will hook you more of the small ones - if you want them.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
462 Posts
should be going out with Charlie at the end of this month,what are the chances of good tope ?and how does he feel about taking a few mackerel away for freezing ? only the second time out with Charlie and 4th time all together on a boat.i was tempted to order some circle hooks BUT i think im going with the cox and rawle meathooks.like tracemate said the way things get done on charlies boat are mono and hook the macks through the lips.

if you haven`t been on charlie`s boat i cant stress enough how much of a beast it really is :) oh and tracemate what do you mean by "turn the hook" ? thanks in advance.
Hi,
Charlie has been boating plenty of Tope, so the chances are you should have a good day. Charlie has banned the use of wire so use mono.
He hates circle hooks so use them at your peril.
When I said turn the hook, what I meant was the hook needs to be pulled into the scissors, to do this it must be inside the mouth.
Charlie will have no problems with taking Mackerel, on one trip he filleted prepared and microwaved some for us on board mmm.
Gary
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,639 Posts
.
.
.
.
.

For me it's heavy mono and either 8/0 Cox and Rawle Meat Hook, or 8/0 bronzed o'shaughnessey(never stainless as there are times a hook has to be left in a fish)
Sounds like personal preference is the answer.
Gary
You leave hooks that rust in a fish ?
Wouldn't surgical steel be much less harmful to them than rust ? After all no one uses mild steel in surgery.


:unsure:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
280 Posts
You leave hooks that rust in a fish ?
Wouldn't surgical steel be much less harmful to them than rust ? After all no one uses mild steel in surgery.


:unsure:
Yes, people leave hooks that rust in fish! The hook rusts away quickly in sea water, the trace falls away and the wound left behind heals up.
If you use stainless steel the hook doesn't rot away and the fish is stuck with a hook in it's mouth and a wound that can't heal up.

Rex Hunt has explained this hundreds of times.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
462 Posts
I always used to use a short wire bite backing onto a length of 80lb mono trace for tope, but then moved on to 200-250lb co-polymer mono for the whole trace. It knots easily and cleanly with no noticeable knot ruffle as seen with most cheap heavy monos when knotted. This worked great until I was bitten off by three tope in the one weekend when downtiding! Have now regressed to a short wire bite backing on to the 80lb co-polymer trace. I would advise anyone doing any serious regular downtide toping to do the same.
For uptide tope fishing, I alternate between wire/co-polymer and straight heavy co-polymer. I haven't had a bite through with the co-polymer only approach when uptiding, but my shot confidence hazards that it's probably only a matter of time. Circle hooks on the heavy co-polymer and slow hands may well be the most fool-proof answer.
Can you be sure you were bitten off by Tope? Were you fishing an area frequented by other sharks?
I was once spooled by a Tope, untill Charlie said that was no Tope, It was big and black with proper teeth(porgie)
I have landed Tope to 72lb on 250lb mono and never been bitten off.
Gary
 
1 - 20 of 31 Posts
Top