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Discussion Starter #1
As some of you may be aware I use my aged Range Rover to go fishing:- I consider myself extremely fortunate to be able to do so and it allows me to access parts and marks of my favourite beach that would otherwise be inaccessible (I don't consider a 10 mile round walk along sand carrying fishing gear a realistic prospect). The powers that be allow limited access to this beach as long as a permit is aquired-this is a simple matter of filling in a form and agreeing to abide by a few simple rules these include; using a vehicle capable of hauling itself off the beach under its own steam, abiding by a 15 mph speed limit when traversing the main bathing part of the beach (clearly marked by 'barber poles') and restricting use to facilitating the pursuit of 'traditional sea angling'. I personally think these are eminently sensible and recognise that being able to use my vehicle in this way is a privilege and not a right. So I would urge anyone who wishes to do likewise to also follow a few guidelines that I myself adhere to. Please try and leave nothing on the beach except tyre tracks and try and limit even these. Use only clearly defined entrances and exits and limit your driving to the hard sand left by the retreating tide. Do not drive too close to other beach users-they are there to enjoy the beach too and might not appreciate being buzzed by some flash git in a 4x4. Sand dunes are the best protection against erosion and are extremely susceptable to damage caused by heavy vehicles so do not attempt to drive over them (you'll only get stuck anyway). You are likely to want to fish far away from other people-else why bother using your vehicle and walk it, so be prepared; take some spare petrol, a tow rope, spare tyre( make sure it's inflated and take a piece of timber to rest your jack on to stop it disappearing into soft sand), shovel, WD40 is a good thing to carry anyway, something to aid grip (sand ladders are ideal but old carpet is an adequate substitue) and a mobile phone. If your 4x4 is as old as mine a spare battery and jump leads are a good idea. When you park to fish remember that the tide is unpredictable and although you might seem to be fishing a flat beach it may well come in behind you and cut you off-try and make sure you have a clear line of sight escape route back above the strand line-the best 4x4 ever made still cannot float. Of course it is good off-roading practice to go in pairs but obviously this is not always practicable so try and make sure that you can help yourself as much as possible. On the subject of help if you see anyone in difficulty go and assist, I have lost count of the number of cars I have pulled off the beach, my philosophy is that it might be me next time-and incidentaly I have never accepted payment. To sum up: 4x4s can be a great asset to fishing but remember there are a number of people that wish to ban them on principle DON'T GIVE THEM THE AMMUNITION be prepared, considerate to others and try and eliminate or at least minimise any environmental impact your action may have.



Sorry guys but this is a serious post and therefore no smilies-I
realise that people wanting to drive on the beach are a minority but I feel that the points I have made are important and I would respectfully suggest a 'sticky' on this post.
 

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London is the place they should be banning 4x4s from. What you're doing with them is simply what they were designed for.
 

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Good one paid4. I reckon that text could be tarted up and thrust into the main site as an article (full credits to your good self). Why don't you ask Mike, he is always looking for stuff.
 

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The Bean Counter
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Ok where shall we start. Environment? Large vehicles driving at slow speeds around grid locked streets use up a hell of a lot of fuel. Lots of gases= warmer climate=warmer seas=traditional fish species heading north.
Also on busy streets it is hard work following a 4x4 (yes I know this applies to vans as well), you just can't see what is going on in front of the 4x4 because of their size. Although this does make for an interesting check on the speed of your reactions when the brake lights in front come on. Ah you say you should not be following so close. Well if you don't some other beggar will pull into the gap that you left.
A 4x4 is designed to go up mountains, across desserts and fields, not rumble around city streets taking kids to school etc. Driving a 4x4 in a city is the same as taking your sea gear fishing for Gudgeon in a canal.
 

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ohhhh scary so i better get rid of my 2.5 litre mpv then not sorry i am gunna drive were and what i like what a nasty person i am .
 

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fizz said:
ohhhh scary so i better get rid of my 2.5 litre mpv then not sorry i am gunna drive were and what i like what a nasty person i am .
sorry forgot to ask what snaggle what motor do you drive ?
 

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The Bean Counter
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A bog standard 1600 familly saloon. If money was no object then it would be an Aston Martin DB9 + a Range Rover for the fishing trips.
Fizz you have a right to drive any vehicle you want and i'm not one to judge but you did ask why 4x4 shouldn't be a London vehicle.
 

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think of the enviroment leave your 4 x 4 in the car park (4 x 4's are as annoying as jet ski;s).
 

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Snaggletooth said:
A bog standard 1600 familly saloon. If money was no object then it would be an Aston Martin DB9 + a Range Rover for the fishing trips.
Fizz you have a right to drive any vehicle you want and i'm not one to judge but you did ask why 4x4 shouldn't be a London vehicle.
ok fair comment
 

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joe roberts said:
think of the enviroment leave your 4 x 4 in the car park (4 x 4's are as annoying as jet ski;s).
Not all 4x4 and jet ski owners are as inconsiderate as you seem to be making out joe and there are bigger issues on this planet of ours dont you think?
 

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fizz said:
please explain why they should be banned then lucky:(
In addition to the environmental and road conjestion issues that Snaggletooth has mentioned 4x4s also present a seriously increased danger to other road users. Any pedestrian, cyclist, motorcyclist or motorist in ordinary car that is involved in a collision with a 4x4 has a far greater chance of ending up dead. The problem has become so bad in parts of the States that people who would otherwise never have considered buying a 4x4 now feel it necessary to buy one simply to protect themselves and their family from other 4x4 users. This has increased dramatically since the introduction of the Humvee - a craze that thankfully has appeared not to have really caught on here in the UK - thus further adding to the negative environmental impact caused by 4x4s in urban areas. 4x4s are not suitable vehicles for use in crowded urban areas and were not originally designed for this purpose. A significant number of 4x4s is to be found in the area of London where I live. The closest the majority of them ever seem get to being "off road" is the supermarket carpark where they take up 1½ spaces instead of one.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
I posted this, with the agreement of Swelleyman, in order to give a few pointers to anyone who might want to use a 4x4 for the purposes of beach fishing. These were intended to enable such people to do so in as safe a manner as possible and to limit any environmental damage to the beach as much as possible. It was never intended to open up a wider debate as to the general use of such vehicles and maybe such a discussion should take place in a different thread and not in the shore fishing forum.
 

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You're probably right paidfor but there's no doubt that people using 4x4s inappropriately in conjested urban areas have biased public opinion against 4x4s in general so that people such as yourself who use them in a responsible manner for the legitimate purposes they were designed for now come in for criticism.
 

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I think that the problem with the original thread was that it sounded as though you were just wanting to roar up and down the beach in your 4x4 now that it has been posted with a little more detail then I don't see how anyone could have any cause to complain.....



As they say "the devil's in the detail" :D
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Barrie-that's precisely why I posted the original thread I try and drive responsibly on the beach and did not want to give the impression that I don't. I might as well give my general opinion of 4x4s as everyone else is. I am fortunate in that I am able to run 3 cars-one for 'er indoors ( she has to commute 25 miles every day) one for when I need to drive and the aged Range for fishing, carrying stuff(building materials etc). I don't use it for the school run for example. When I needed a workhorse I fancied a Landrover because I could then use it fishing instead of the likes of a transit van. Landrovers were out of my budget and-as I wanted something that was a real 4x4 that's how I ended up with a Range Rover. Now let me let you into a secret-it's not that nice to drive it's slow, handles like a coracle in a whirpool, noisy and not that comfortable, having said that it's much better than some others I've tried. Modern 4x4s such as new Range Rovers, BMW X5s and the Mercedes M-class are in my opinion a waste of time. This is not because of urban congestion, which I think is a specious argument (an X5 takes up no more space than a 5 series estate) or pedestrian safety ( the X5 for example would cause no more damage than a Transit or even a Renault Espace). But because of the inherent compromise of all the 4 wheel drive technology-Which will never be used. This is not because they live in Knightsbridge but because of the cost of these things; I have been called mad as cheese by some but even I would not take a £60,000 Range Rover onto the beach, also because they have to utilise so much technology to provide their owners with that feeling of-I could if I want to-while preserving some degree of comfort on the road that by the time depreciation does its work and they fall into the hands of someone who could use their capabilities; he won't be able to because they'll be broken and anyway I wouldn't trust a fifteen year old computer to get me out of trouble over something I can fix with a couple of spanners and a lump hammer. In my opinion and this is only my opinion such vehicles could easily be replaced by a sensible family saloon and an aged Range/Land Rover and have the best of both worlds-probably for considerably less money. Oh and on the subject I bought my Rangy on E-bay. It cost me £65 to get to Shoeburyness to pick it up and £45 in petrol to come home and I could have brought 4 people with me. That's potentially £325 versus £45 in a 3 and a half litre Range Rover Something is wrong here I apologise for the length of this post but I intend it to be my last word on the subject-now I'm off to take the p**s out of Poachers catches, Marcus' taste in music and to try and persuade Lisa that her sister is better off living in Wales not Australia. ;)
 

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Roller
I dont think we need to justify our use of our 4x4s on a beach where they are allowed/welcomed, provided they are registered for use, & we abide by the registration rules.
We dont enter illegally through private land, we keep to the 15mph speed limit, we dont carry out any illegal or commercial act whilst on the beach. We dont interfere with the land yachters or kite yachters who are also welcome on the beach, & who do 50mph plus (quite legally, outside the restricted zone). We either park above the HWST line out of the way, or hug the rising tide line, again out of the way, the other beach activities go on between those lines totally undisturbed, or unaware of our presence.
We use our 4x4s quite openly & legally to reach areas of the beach that are unfishable on foot, I dont consider a 7 mile "yomp" with full fishing kit, at 65, a "necessary gesture" to the small minority of forum readers, who feel a need to cleanse their environmental conciences (mainly because they dont have a 4x4 to use, or a beach nearby where they are ENTITLED to use it)!
If I lived near a beach where the use of vehicles was prohibited, for reasons known only to the legislators, then I would be brassed off as well, but with us, where access is limited to a single entrance, (impassable except to 4x4s), & the best fishing is 2/3 miles either side away from the public entrance, there is no problem, & fortunately Carmarthenshire County Council are sensible enough to see that, & allow us & the other beach sport users to carry on under their guidance.
Lets just carry on using our 4x4s for what they were intended, (I use mine for my job in forestry during the week), & let our forum "anti's" (who doubtless cycle 20+ miles per day to work, to save the planet), take up the argument with the "Chelsea 4x4 set", who do use them as penis extensions. See you on the HWST mark on the next good tide!
blueskip
 
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